Did you know that some of my early blog interviews were done via email?
I can’t imagine doing that now.
But at the time it was my alternative to an in-person interview.
And people quite liked the option of writing their considered answers.
What was missing was the connection I feel when interviewing someone. Hearing the story behind the words. Hearing the passion in their voice, or watching their face light up.
Also missing was the ability to ask different questions, to gain clarity on a point or even change direction.
Having said that, I have no regrets about doing written interviews. I probably would have had less people willing to be interviewed in those early days without that option. And they were also much easier for me to write up! No need to interpret the voice to text conversion.
I think that often in life and work we do things a certain way for a variety of reasons, then as we learn and grow, we change our approach.
Even my in-person interview technique has evolved.
Through trying to pick my words out of the quotes of my interviewee I learned to listen with my body not my mouth!
I learned that direct eye contact makes it hard for some people to feel comfortable sharing, so looking away from them can be better, and I learned to take my cue from the interviewee.
Discovering that some of the best stories come from asking for more about a point that was made instead of just moving to my next question meant that I listened harder for those gems.
My own reactions sometimes have to be stifled – especially my tendency to ponder on what was just said to me while the poor interviewee waits for my next question!
And I learned that a good interview and a good coaching session have a lot in common!
I hope my blogs have been improving as I get better at interviewing – my goal is to do justice to the amazing stories that are shared with me.
I often get asked about writing this blog – how I got started, why I got started, how I find people to interview.
So today I am going to write about some of those things.
I started the blog due to several questions that all led to a blog being the answer.
Firstly, I was on the possible redundancy list at work and someone on LinkedIn suggested that if I lost my job, I could go on the speaking circuit talking about agile and software testing. I was horrified! Not at public speaking, that appealed, but at talking about software testing which I had only recently moved on from after years of trying to move in a different direction. That got me thinking about what I could talk about. The only thing I felt passionate enough about at the time was (you guessed it!) ‘stepping out of your comfort zone’. But I didn’t think there would be an audience.
Secondly, I had some time off after some surgery and did a lot of reading. This included some books by Dorie Clark on networking for introverts as well as ways of standing out from the crowd – they included blogging as a way of making a name for yourself and asking people to be interviewed as a way of networking. But again, I had no subject to write about.
The last pieces of the puzzle came together in a conversation after a Christmas BBQ in 2018. A friend who was on the public speaking circuit himself told me that there would most definitely be an audience for the topic of ‘stepping out of your comfort zone’. We also discussed that writing a blog would give me content for speaking as well as a level of being an ‘authority’ on the topic.
Out of those events the thought came to me: ‘What if I wrote a blog about stepping out of your comfort zone, and instead of just my own stories I asked others to share theirs?’
My first step was to ask people if I they would share their stories. And was blown away by the number of people who said yes – keeping in mind that at this stage the blog did not exist! I also wrote a few of my own stories ready to post.
I decided I needed at least 10 blogs ready to post before I started, so if I got busy at work, I always had a backlog. I started off with such a backlog that I posted twice weekly for a while – a decision I regretted when the interviewees dried up.
Technically – I googled how to start a blog. I bought my domain name and set up a wordpress site. A dear friend agreed to do my artwork. That part did not take long and was not expensive. I did make some mistakes. I chose the wrong hosting platform initially (wrong as in their inclusions were poor and their help desk was really a sales desk). Trying to switch hosting platforms after buying a domain name from them made things more complicated than they needed to be.
The last area, and still the one I struggle with the most is finding people to interview! I ask on various platforms and I send direct requests (less often as that often involves making people feel bad if they say no). Sometimes people come to me either via referrals (thank you to all those who have referred someone!!) or they approaching me directly after reading my blog. I am open to suggestions as to how to do that part more effectively. These days I never seem to have a huge backlog!
I get joy in every single story I hear – regardless of whether it is a more relatable step out of the comfort zone or something ambitious and unattainable to most. I laugh and cry as I interview people, or just empathise strongly. I don’t ask a heap of questions; I prefer to let people talk with a few questions to help them tell their story.
I hope that answers your questions – and don’t forget to let me know if you have a story to share with me!
Words by me (Fiona) based on an interview with Brian. Image by me.
Brian didn’t feel that stepping out of his comfort zone was a choice. He had reached a point in his life where his high-powered career was costing him physically, emotionally and mentally. He had a tipping point at an international airport, and the story he shared is what happened after that.
As a little back story – Brian moved to Australia with his family as a transfer for the company he was working for in South Africa. Shortly after he arrived the dotcom crash meant he had to close his division! He continued on for 12 months before moving to an IT security business where he moved from ops director to COO to being part of running the Asian arm of the company. By this point he was away more than home, and this was having an impact on his relationships with his family and others.
It was sitting in Bangalore airport that Brian found himself silently crying – pointed out to him by a stranger! “And I’m embarrassed to say that I now realize I was having an emotional breakdown in Bangalore airport. And that I was living an unaligned and therefore unsustainable life. I was getting paid a lot of money but I was disconnected from family and friends. I was unhealthy physically, mentally, emotionally, and it just all came to a head.”
Brian feels that, since then, the next 12 years has included two parallel journeys – one above the line and one below the line. The below the line journey was about better understanding his struggle with anxiety and depression and being able to manage ‘it’, rather than ‘it’ continuing to manage him. The above the line journey was all about “becoming the person I was designed to be. We all are unique. And it’s about really trying to understand how that all comes together into some sort of uniqueness”. This above the line journey has led to Brian becoming an ‘Alignment and Movement Strategist’.
Some of Brian’s above the line journey was accidental. An offer of a senior position at a big company fell through at the last minute. Taking that job would have led to a different outcome “I don’t think I would have survived. I know it wasn’t right for me.
“Increasingly though, I am living a life of increased intentionality, and a lot of what I help my clients to do is live more intentionally too.”
Six years ago, Brian started his own practice, as an Alignment and Movement Strategist, and has not looked back!
His advice for anyone planning – or being forced – to move out of their comfort zone?
“Don’t do it alone. And be kind to yourself.”
Brian also reflected on using what you have experienced rather than always looking forward: “I find that leaders live in the future. It’s part of why they get paid. They’re thinking about what’s coming, what’s happening, preparing themselves, their teams, their business for the future. I think the mindfulness movement has been quite helpful in slowing people down and being more present. However, an area that I think leaders tend not to go is the past. Yet so much learning in the past. Take the time to learn from it.”
“If someone’s wanting to step out of their comfort zone I would love to explore why. And I would say what they want probably has something to do with their backstory and the past”.
“For me part of the intentionality thing is, what is it you are moving away from and what are you moving towards? And appreciating what you have now.”
Brian finished with some last words that I loved: “Really engage with your why!”
A little about Brian: Brian describes himself an Alignment and Movement Strategist – working as a Mentor, an Executive Coach, a Facilitator, and is passionate about helping both organisations and individuals, operate in a more aligned, more sustainable and therefore more effective manner, with a strong sense of movement in the ‘right’ direction.
Image by me (Fiona) Words by me based on an interview with Gordon
Gordon wants to make a difference in the lives of the majority – the 99% not the 1%. He wants to help people achieve extraordinary outcomes. He says he gets called a square peg in a round hole.
I think he is a man with great passions and an unconventional approach!
One of Gordons biggest steps outside his comfort zone was when he put his hand up for a C-suite role in the international firm he worked for. He was only about 20-25% qualified for the position! What Gordon did was obtain the support of the COO and a really respected financial adviser so when he asked for the role he went in with support ready to go! His first task was to make part of the team redundant – so he certainly stayed uncomfortable once he started the role.
Gordon believes that our experiences shape our comfort zones “I think it stems from my childhood. I think there’s five or six different instances that change your life. Maybe it’s being bullied three times a day school. And the way I got myself out of that was to learn martial art. Then I came to Australia where I didn’t know anyone. And the first question you get asked in Australia is which football team do you support? Which school did you go to? Well, I don’t support an Australian football team. And I’ve never been to an Australian school so I had to find my own way.
“I’m dyslexic, so I can’t read well. So, I can’t write a book. But I can produce a book, I found a different way to produce a book. And then that book was produced in four days. It cost virtually nothing to produce it. And it’s sold over 4000 copies. And I haven’t paid for any advertising at all. “
Gordons advice is not to follow other people’s paths. That may be the right path for them but not necessarily for you.
The benefits Gordon finds outside of his comfort zone are often side effects! One example is that his wife was very ill, requiring a double lung transplant. Unable to keep working in the corporate world, Gordon discovered a passion for medical science and research – and started a very successful charity as a result!
“Life’s too short, a we’ve got to make every day count. And the last thing we need to do is go to the cemetery wondering what if!
“And when you take that step forward, tell people why you have taken that step. Tell people what it means to you, when you take that step. And what you’ll find very quickly is a group of people (I call it your ecosystem), who are really supporting you. Supporting you in terms of that advice, that support network, that healthy support network that will encourage people to push through. And what will happen is all those toxic people, those people that love to say no will suddenly disappear. So, do it, ‘just do it’ and take people with you . It’s your pathway, but it’s our journey. I’m here to – help and encourage you and support you along the way. I may not have taken the actual step, the same step as you. But I’ve got experiences.”
Thank you, Gordon, for your great story and outlook.
A little about Gordon:
Gordon Jenkins is an authority on visibility and unconventional business growth. As an executive coach, accomplished entrepreneur, speaker and author of Network with Purpose, he helps entrepreneurs and professionals breakthrough their plateau to achieve sustainable business growth and personal life goals. His intention is to facilitate growth that aligns with an individuals’ values and strengths so they achieve success that is meaningful to them
Gordon’s success and that of his clients stems from the strong belief that it’s okay not to conform to the system, it’s refreshing to be different, and that being a square peg in a round hole is a good thing. He is a supporter of the underdog and his purpose is to help ordinary people achieve extraordinary and meaningful outcomes every day. For more information about Gordon, please visit www.iamgordonjenkins.com or LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamgordonjenkins/ There is also a free resource: 30 ways to make networking feel less like work
Story by Fiona based on an interview with Shilpa Image by Fiona
Until 18 months ago Shilpa was very comfortable in her life. An amazing career spanning 16 years had been everything she wanted. Until she was made redundant. This was a wake up call for Shilpa – that someone else had control over her career like that.
Shilpa decided to take the opportunity to take back that control and try something completely new – follow her passion into a coaching career!
After years of staying comfortable Shilpa now steps out of her comfort zone on a daily basis!
Today she speaks regularly at public events and live videos. “I was a very shy person. I used to be a loner, very comfortable in my world and with my thoughts. And then I said, ‘Okay, let me go out there and put myself in front of the public. How bad can it be?’
“Speaking from the stage has been a great part of my journey! And today when I’m teaching other people to do the same, I know each of them can do it because I have walked that path myself”
Shilpa took a non-traditional approach to her new career! “So my initial feeling was okay, this is exciting. And then when I started, the biggest question I faced was ‘where do I get the credibility?’ I had a comfort zone for years; I was fully established there. People knew me, I had the relationships. And how do I create that credibility immediately in this new field when I am doing something totally different? It all came together somehow, but initially there was some, I wouldn’t say fear, but a hesitation whether it would work or not. But then I realised that I had built credibility all along, it was all that commitment, dedication, result orientation, everything that I had built in those 16 years. I just have to pull them along from my previous life and create some amazing results in the new industry and there you go- my credibility was there.“
Well done Shilpa!
There are good reasons why Shilpa regularly challenges herself “When you are sitting in your comfort zone, you get rusty. You’re just do what you know, over and over again. And you feel that you know it all. Whereas the fact is that you’ve not seen the world outside. And slowly you start getting this feeling that I’m comfortable here, but can I survive in the world outside, if required? Ultimately life does throw challenges. But if we can figure out a way to respond to it with whatever we have, that confidence and action orientation is the success mantra. Constantly getting out of your comfort zone, no matter how small the step is, gives you unlimited confidence, those juices which tell you that life is in control, no matter what “
Shilpa’s advice to anyone considering stepping out of their comfort zone is to just do it – don’t look for the 1000 reasons why not to do it, Reasons are for not doing things rather than for doing things.
I also asked Shilpa her favourite part of stepping out of her comfort zone “My favourite bit is the experience. Each of us have our own experiences. And if we go and we embrace more of such experiences, our life becomes richer. I’m not saying that everywhere there will be a win – there will be failures as well. But definitely there will be learnings.”
“So I would say, don’t overthink, JUST DO IT and whether it works or not, the learning you will get out of it, will go a long way in building that story that you’re writing for YOUR tomorrow.”
My favourite quote – “that story that you’re writing for YOUR tomorrow”. How powerful!
About Shilpa:
As a Career Strategist, Peak Performance Coach and #1 International bestselling author of the book “Play it Full”, Shilpa believe that you can attain incredible results in all three aspects of life- Achievements, Health and Relationships. You can have it all!
She is on a mission to impact 1 million people move from the role of a creation to a creator.
Her mentees are rocking their life today by performing at an elevated level, creating outstanding results for themselves.
Shilpa has mastered the magic formula and so is on a war against the average game.
The purpose of her life today is to share this formula, this awesome sauce with the world, so that each person gets an opportunity to fly high and through a ripple effect, it creates an exceptional world for all of us.
Words and image by me (Fiona) Words based on an interview with Johnathan
Johnathan is a serial ‘step out of your comfort zoner’, but shared with me one of his 9 career transitions!
He was working as a recruiter: “I’d recently removed from New Zealand to Australia. So I was very fortunate enough to come over with a job when we moved here. I was working in in recruitment but my heart wasn’t really in it, I was getting frustrated with how recruitment worked. But one night I thought I know what a good CV and a good LinkedIn profile and I know what a bad one looks like. No one’s actually telling the candidates this we’re just rejecting, rejecting, rejecting. We’re not actually saying ‘hey, this is what you are doing wrong’, there was nobody providing sort of feedback. I felt that everyone was working for the client as a recruitment consultant, but no one was working for the candidate.
“And so I had a like an epiphany moment as I was sitting on the couch off to the shower and I thought, I’m going to try something tomorrow and I’m going to push this boat out as far as I can before it sinks.”
Johnathan ran with his epiphany immediately, talking ‘the mother of all epic sickies’ the very next day and calling a local school that taught Microsoft technical education. He was able to secure a meeting with the head of the school for that afternoon “I said, ‘hey, look, I’m a career coach. And I specialise in helping people build their technical careers. I’d love to come in and talk to your students, if I can, about how to set themselves up for success.’ “
“He said to me, ‘Well, this sounds like a really good idea. When can you come in and talk to one of my classes and share these tips?’ And I say, well, as luck would have it, I have some time available this afternoon!”
Once there Johnathan told the head of the school about his background and his idea – and found himself in front of the students that same visit!
“The guy said to me, ‘this sounds amazing. Tell you what, I’ve got a class running right now. Do you want to jump in right now and just have a bit of a chat to these students?’”
Despite having nothing prepared, Johnathan continued to push that boat out and spoke to the students for an hour and a half!
“I walked out of there really, really invigorated because I kind of reconnected with my passion. So the interesting thing is that he said to me, at the end of it, ‘look, that was fantastic. When can you come in again, we’d like you to develop a programme.’ And I thought to myself, ‘okay, look, I’ll come back to you on that one’ – because I knew I had to go back to work the next day.
“I was so far outside my comfort zone, but I was being kind of propelled by this energy in this interview. And this, this wow feeling. And at the same time I was also had that voice in the back of my head going, What the hell are you doing?”
This huge day led eventually to the business Jonathan now runs.
Johnathan has some great advice for people thinking about stepping out of their comfort zone “One thing that I teach people is reframing the comfort zone or reframing the tasks that you want to accomplish. We’ll call it an experiment, which means if you think about your career, and it’s on a long sort of line, why don’t we take a small part of where you’re sitting at right now, and let’s just extract it out. Let’s find something that you can do. That is not going to impact in your career. If it doesn’t work, we’ll try another approach. So this is not the be all and end all of your whole entire life. But most times we put in a good framework and we set the experiment up for success.”
Johnathan had other great techniques for stepping out of your comfort zone, but instead I am going to share with you his final words – you can always contact Johnathan to find out more!
“Sometimes getting outside your comfort zone means confronting yourself and your professional self in a mirror and going, what am I? Where do I want to go? How do I need to position myself to get there? How do I understand the full range of what who I am and what I do and the value that I bring to an organisation?
“So part of getting out of your comfort zone means going on a journey of figuring out and finding out who and what you are. And that can be an incredibly rewarding experience and one that can really build and foster a greater sense of self confidence in people. So getting outside of your comfort zone can produce an enormous amount of reward, career acceleration, and purpose and fulfilment.”
Thank you so much Johnathan!
About Johnathan:
Johnathan is a Career Consultant who specialises in Professional Identity and Personal Brand Management. Using a structured method, he enables his clients to de-clutter their heads so they can gain a greater understanding of who and what they are, their capabilities and most importantly what makes them valuable. He also helps them increase their professional self-awareness so that they can move their careers forward with greater confidence and clarity of direction. Johnathan typically works with professionals at mid-career phase (Gen-X), to define their professional identity and then build a powerful Personal Brand to help them re-energise their careers and attract exciting opportunities. You can read more at johnmaltby.com. au or connect with him on LinkedIn – https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnathanmaltby/
Akansha came from a “bubble of not knowing how to do things on my own” to move to Australia to complete her Masters!
Akansha had never stayed anywhere without her immediate family prior to making this momentous decision.
“In my mind for first couple of weeks it kept feeling as if I was on a on a sleepover with the people [new roommates] and it felt like I was on a long holiday.
“And after a while, once uni started, that’s when it just all came out at once like ‘oh my god, I miss everyone.’”
Everything was new – from grocery shopping to living with strangers. That was mixed with studying and having to earn money to live on. The smallest thing was an adjustment – learning that ‘ta’ meant thank you not good bye for example! The stress was overwhelming, and for the first time since she was born Akansha found herself in hospital. This added to her financial stress. To top it all off, she is working on getting her permanent residency to be able to stay in Australia. The process is very expensive and lot of jobs demand PR which is career limiting.
So, with all the above – plus regular racism – why would Akansha persevere?
“First of all, I had taken this decision that I wanted to experience what it is living outside of home and in a new country altogether. That kept me going.
“There’s always light at the tunnel and this is what my mum told me. My parents have been biggest support for me.”
Akansha’s parents continuously reminded her of her achievements – passing exams despite being hospitalised, getting her internship at Telstra – and also that she just had to keep at it.
Her sister also moved to Australia which helps a lot!
When I asked Akansha if there were benefits from stepping out of her comfort zone her whole face lit up with joy and pride! “I have grown in last three years so much that I did not in last 20 years of being India. I have learned finances, time management skills, and life experiences. I feel mature.
“From the time I stepped in Australia to the time right now I have grown mentally. And it doesn’t mean that there are not many challenges that keep me thinking and trying to get better. My attitude has changed. The way I look at things or the problems. I’m not saying it’s perfect all the time. Absolutely not. But definitely when I compare myself to what I was like in 2017 to what I am like in 2020… I guess I feel like I’m not a child. “
The advice Akansha has for people considering stepping out of their comfort zone is to just go for it. If you over think it you will see all the issues, if you focus on your end goal you will resolve those hurdles as you go “I have to paint that thing. And if you don’t have brushes, that’s the problem. And then you keep thinking ‘I don’t have brushes, I don’t have brushes.’ But if you if you think ‘yes, I will paint’ then you will go and buy brushes!”
Akansha’s last words were to create a support group and then include them in your celebrations! “I celebrate every year, so in February I was celebrating 3 years in Australia, and I had a celebratory dinner”
Photo by Jason Briscoe on Unsplash Words by me (Fiona) based on an interview with Sarah
Sarah agreed to be interviewed as she is trying to say yes as much as possible, she has found that stepping out of her comfort zone encourages her to do it more often.
We spoke specifically about Sarah learning Taekwondo. A few years ago Sarah was challenged by her coach to “do something that I wasn’t comfortable with doing”. Sarah is an outgoing person and often pushes herself, but she “tend[s] to do it in an area that I’m still quite knowledgeable in or experienced in or doesn’t fill me with too much fear”.
So at around 40 Sarah started learning Taekwondo. It was not just out of her comfort zone to learn something new, “I’ve never had really had a hobby, never really committed to anything that consistently I am entirely not sporty. I have a terrible memory and I’m not particularly coordinated.”
Sarah even found that there was a challenge within her challenge. “One of the biggest challenges I had was as part of doing Taekwondo. You shout to help signal when something’s completed, or when you hit someone if you’re sparring. And then despite being very vocal, and despite being very comfortable with being loud and singing to have quite a strong voice, I actually found that for a good six to eight weeks of me doing Taekwondo, I couldn’t do the shouting.”
When Sarah took on her coaches challenge, she didn’t even consider the benefits of doing so, she just accepted the challenge. But on reflection there were definitely upsides. Learning taekwondo had its own perks – fitness, improved coordination, an hour where work is not even considered, and meeting new people are some of those – but there were also benefits that were outside of those. For Sarah she learned that the initial discomfort doesn’t last very long, and you might get something fun from the experience! “And I think this stepping out of the comfort zone just made me realise that you know you never too old to do it either. So you are never too old to try a new career, try a new sport, pick up something new”
I asked Sarah (surprise!) about advice for someone else considering stepping out of their comfort zone “The same advice I got given, which was just pick up the toothpick. My coach taught me a game… where you picking up toothpicks, and get little bits of feedback every time until you pick up the correct toothpick. And when kids play the game, they just play it really quickly. And they just take the feedback and they just respond very quickly. But the older we get, we have more fear and there’s more embarrassment that stops us from doing things like stepping out of your comfort zone or trying new experiences or new jobs or new careers or whatever it is that you’re doing. And she has constantly said to me, just pick up the toothpick, just pick up the toothpick and I, probably on a weekly basis, think to myself just pick up the toothpick, Sarah, just have a go. And if it doesn’t work out, you don’t like it or you find that you’re not particularly good at it but you love it, then you’ve got more knowledge about yourself than you did before. So my advice would be the same that she gave me which was pick up the toothpick and you might get something great come out.”
